Kathi M. Responds

 Kathi M. Response:
"Jacqueline,

I may not have given enough rationalization of why it is unethical to call in sick when you aren't.  I believe it is unethical to lie in these sort of cases.  Saying you are sick when you're not is lying.  Also if someone used all their sick leave when they weren't sick, and then truly had a serious injury or illness (and no vacation time,) they'd be eligible (in civil service) to ask for others to donate their leave.  It isn't right to defraud others into donating their hard earned leave to you, after you lied and used your leave for other purposes other than that for which it was designed.  I believe your bad karma will get you when you least expect it.

For our discussion, I think we need to agree on a meaning of the term:  “ethics.”

I like the Santa Clara University Markkula Center for applied Ethics definition by Manuel Velasquez, Claire Andre, Thomas Shanks, S.J., and Michael J. Meyer.  They describe ethics as the following:

“Being ethical is also not the same as following the law. The law often incorporates ethical standards to which most citizens subscribe. But laws, like feelings, can deviate from what is ethical. Our own pre-Civil War slavery laws and the old apartheid laws of present-day South Africa are grotesquely obvious examples of laws that deviate from what is ethical.” (Velasquex, Andrew, Shanks, J., & Meyer, 2010)

 “Ethics refers to well-founded standards of right and wrong that prescribe what humans ought to do, usually in terms of rights, obligations, benefits to society, fairness, or specific virtues.. … Secondly, ethics refers to the study and development of one's ethical standards. As mentioned above, feelings, laws, and social norms can deviate from what is ethical. So it is necessary to constantly examine one's standards to ensure that they are reasonable and well-founded. Ethics also means, then, the continuous effort of studying our own moral beliefs and our moral conduct, and striving to ensure that we, and the institutions we help to shape, live up to standards that are reasonable and solidly-based.” (Velasquex, Andrew, Shanks, & Meyer, 2010)

 So let’s examine the copying of DVD’s before you return them.  Since being ethical isn’t always the same as following the law, is it unethical simply because it is illegal? I don't think so, if you consider some of the unfair laws we had in our own country years ago.  Ethics is following the standards of right and wrong, in terms of the rights and obligations and benefits to society. Does copying the DVD’s hurt society?  Is copying the DVD’s fair to the artists, distribution corporations, or stockholders in the production companies?  If not, then is it ethical?

Is flirting with a cop acting in a sexual way?  Even if it is, what is to say that it is unethical? Is it against the law to flirt? (not that being legal is a surefire way to determine the ethics of the situation) Is flirting against the standards of right and wrong in society?  Not in many cultures. 

Are you saying it is not unethical to run a stop sign or red light or exceed the speed limit?  Not sure what you mean here.  What is the obligation or benefit to society to follow the rules? 

Reference: 

Velasquex, M., Andrew, C., Shanks, T., J., S.,  & Meyer, M.J. (2010). What is ethics?. Retrieved from http://www.scu.edu/ethics/practicing/decision/whatisethics.html"

MY RESPONSE:

 Hi Kathi,

  If i had a soul it would hurt right now.. also I didn't read the stuff you copied and pasted in b/c much like the links provided on the homepage of this class I don't really care what some random person or group of people think about a certain topic if I don't agree on any level. (HERE I WAS REFERENCING THE FACT THAT OUR TEACHER PUT A POST ON THE HOMEPAGE WITH LINKS TO SOME BULLSHIT WEBSITES WHERE TEACHERS THINKS IT'S UNETHICAL TO USE YOUR OWN PAPER MORE THAN ONCE.) 

  Using sick days: That's a lot of "what if's" to make it unethical but if you get some terrible disease your ten sick days probably isn't going to cover it anyways also this isn't a conversation about lying to your coworkers to scam them out of their sick days once your poor decision in using your sick days catches up to you. 

  DVD's:  yeah it's technically stealing and not that i care i was just making a point at just calling it illegal.  

  Cops: Yes…flirting is in fact acting in a sexual way… when a boy and a girl like each other…never mind.  Anyways, my actual point before was that copying dvd's was unethical to you b/c it was illegal but you don't find flirting to get out of punishment for doing something illegal as unethical.